| Interestingly enough even though I have DT when I speak to any other race they are more skilled than I am! Now that hurts! |
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I've found that to have a chance at beating Maso, I must take speed and diplomacy picks. Else I get trashed.
| Can't wait for Nightmare (if it ever happens) hopefully they'll make that about equivalent to Maso as it is now and make Maso a little bit easier for us all. |
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That's what I'm hoping for too. The best level for anyone to play is one which you are challenged but not frustrated. I get frustrated with Maso occassionally so I drop back to Crippling to recharge.
         
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| There was only one Maso player who lobbied hard for scoring changes and that was Staffa |
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Several lobbied hard including you.
| Both of them made valuable contributions to scoring IMO. With the pop nerfs, players are no longer able to get big increases in score just by pressing the enter key for more pop. I thought that was a great change which did not merely benefit Maso players. |
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This is non-sequitor to my post. And all it did was change the date of hitting turn. You now do it earlier and give aliens all your pop and morale tech's and wonders before you take em over. It just changed what was milked. Exactly what I said would happen.
The point of my post was these were precisely the changes that dropped the maso (and to a lesser extent crippling) scores. A totally unintended effect. You never answered that point.
| The rearrangement of victory conditions was not a result of lobbying. |
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It wasn't? The several why should someone be able to hide in the corner threads followed by frogboy's
capitulation says otherwise.
  
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| Several lobbied hard including you. |
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Which other Maso player did? Did I? When and where?
| This is non-sequitor to my post. And all it did was change the date of hitting turn. You now do it earlier and give aliens all your pop and morale tech's and wonders before you take em over. It just changed what was milked. Exactly what I said would happen. |
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That's why I made the suggestion to Frogboy when he was asking for scoring feedback not to include pop, tech, TGs/wonders, economy etc in the score. Those are too easy to abuse.
| The point of my post was these were precisely the changes that dropped the maso (and to a lesser extent crippling) scores. A totally unintended effect. You never answered that point. |
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Nope. Pop nerfing affected scores of all difficulty levels from Calkwalk to Maso. A Calkwalk player can get lots more score as well through pressing turn.
| It wasn't? The several why should someone be able to hide in the corner threads followed by frogboy's capitulation says otherwise. |
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I must have missed those threads. Can you tell me where you saw them?
[Message Edited]
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I've compiled a similar profile for the Fellowship,
Calkwalk : 0
Easy : 0
Simple : 2
Beginner : 2
Normal : 5
Challenging : 8
Tough : 1
Painful : 9
Crippling : 8
Maso : 1
Most popular are Challenging, Painful and Crippling.
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| a similar profile for the Fellowship |
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If you weighted it to the last three games, mine are probably atypical - I wanted a few quick games to get up to 20 played and promotion to commodore....
Alex
     
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Yes Alex, I noted you down as one of the four who plays simple/beginner. You are probably more a challenging player looking at your old games.
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Whoa! I'm 13th on the Average Scores board! And mysteriously, I moved up from 92 to 91 overnight... 
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| Whoa! I'm 13th on the Average Scores board! |
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That's a very decent rank for a relative new player like you. 
| And mysteriously, I moved up from 92 to 91 overnight |
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Probably a dormant player got aged down.
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Thanks! Didn't realize how hard it would be to stay in the Top 100!
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| Nope. Pop nerfing affected scores of all difficulty levels from Calkwalk to Maso. A Calkwalk player can get lots more score as well through pressing turn. |
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1. Pop got nerfed.
2. Nerfing one item makes another item relatively more important.
2a, Wonders, are relatively more important now.
2b. Those are things you cannot get as much of on Maso for the most part.
2c. Those are things you can get much more of on lower levels of difficulty.
Conclusion: Nerfing pop hurt maso the most relative to the other levels.
Simple logic. Shame you can't seem to practice it.
That's why I made the suggestion to Frogboy when he was asking for scoring feedback not to include pop, tech, TGs/wonders, economy etc in the score. Those are too easy to abuse.
Yes but what you suggested is totally lame and will result in mass exodous from the metaverse.
Oh well, I'll let the whiners and crybabies do their thing and get back to playing. It's obvious you're just disagreeing to be disagreeable.
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| Oh well, I'll let the whiners and crybabies do their thing and get back to playing. It's obvious you're just disagreeing to be disagreeable. |
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Easy, Pontius. I don't think there's a need for name calling here.
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| Easy, Pontius. I don't think there's a need for name calling here |
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Theoden. It's not namecalling. It's just observation. If it's not one thing wrong with the scoring It's another. Frogboy makes the modifications asked for and no sooner completed then the whining begins again. Then they make their way into our thread and chastise our members for not "playing high enough" Although at least that has stopped for the time being as several got called on it then vowed never to post there again in childish fashion. It really becomes quite tiresome actually. Well Off to the daily grind..... bbl.
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I'm not sure I see it as whining, but you have the right to your own opinion.
In a more fraternal spirit, check out the newest news flash on Fellowship News! It should brighten your day...
 Link
Fellowship News - All the News A Ring Wraith Needs!
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#1091
by Citizen musicfan55 - 8/12/2003 3:21:18 PM
Just for fun, I searched the GROSS thread and EBZeroMatrix (EBZ) has his early strategy on post #1106. Maybe this will save others time. I was really curious how the "high volume" approach is different from the "big galaxy" or "tougher difficulty" when scoring in the metaverse. EBZ says he plays differently now and the July 3 strategy needs a tune-up but the basics are good nuts & bolts strategy. Maybe EBZ will contribute to an updated Orion Gal Civ Strategy Guide sometime.
I played EBZ's basic game of small, abundant, +2 speed, +2 sensors, all victory conditions off, AI on subnormal with overall difficulty beginner. Then I modified it by getting just enough techs to trade soon enough that I never had to cut my spending under 100% in the begining. My basic strategy was to bankrupt the AI fast while trading with a minor. Toward the end I gifted a starbase to the Arceans so the game would last long enough to not only get all the TG/wonders/achievments but research all tech. I was zero level evil so got some extra techs (although nothing approaching the power of trade centers when one plays good). The turn after I researched all the tech I took a few dreadnoughts and combat transports and finished the Arceans. Interestingly, the score was a pretty good 11610 for a beginner game. Sadly, it still took me 5 hours (although I turn off sound and listen to Mozart, Beethoven, Stravinsky, etc. CDs when I play) so I may take longer than most.  .
I wrote this because the beginner game can yield high scores even on small. EBZ is amazing for cranking out several games in the time it took me to play one and for being able to do this all the time. I didn't feel like I beat the AI - I mugged the AI. .
So I think I will try to find a fun level (like Painful) with a map big enough I can research all the techs (smaller than gigantic so probably large or huge). I am still experimenting with density, habitable, and good v. evil. I sure wasted time with my early games by playing neutral. .
I have looked at most of Fellowship metaverse scores and am curious as to favorite sizes of galaxies, habitability, and star density. Perhaps you can share your thoughts on why you think certain maps are the most fun. Of course, variety is fun too. Thanks for your comments.
Rick
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I play Large or Huge because smaller than that and it's too quick (for me). I like longer, drawn out campaigns with some extended wars and lots of exploration.
My favorite setup is Huge/Uncommon/Loose Clusters/Challenging
Not too easy, but not too hard. The AI has room to play, but not enough 15+ planets to run away with it. Actually this setup seems to provide a balanced game (at least for me).
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| Easy, Pontius. I don't think there's a need for name calling here. |
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That's not the first time, Theoden. He resorts to that when he knows he can't outreason someone.
That's why I'm sick of having any form of reasonable discussion with him. Remind me not to respond to him again.
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| Dormant players do not get aged down. Scores only degrade durning calculation, and that only happens when a game is submitted, when a player's scores are converted to a new Drengin.net account, or during a metaverse-wide recalculation which, as far as I know, has only happen once. |
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You are the expert on the Metaverse computations, IceMole. But I could have sworn I've seen some scores get reduced even though that person did not submit a game.
I believe they should do a periodic Metaverse-wide recalc else a dormant player's score would stay at the same level if no further games are submitted.
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| Beware the EBZ matrix! Ahhhh . . . run to the hills! |
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It's either EBZ or EBZeroMatrix, Ctotal.
  
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| EBZ is amazing for cranking out several games in the time it took me to play one and for being able to do this all the time. I didn't feel like I beat the AI - I mugged the AI. . |
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Thanks ricbayer! Nice to see someone appreciate and give me some props for my effort, from another emipre  .
Concerning my newly tweaked strategy, it can be applied to all other versions, but perferably 1.09. I'm working on a website to distribute my new strategy, as I have a saved 1.09 game to go along with it as a teaching aide.
I am currently having problems with using(/learning) Javascript, and anyone that knows this perhaps might be able to help me roll out this site faster so that I can release my guide. But then again, I might get fed up with the JS and release it this Friday if I am in a better mood.
Thanks again ricbayer for the props, and I'll be sure not to add you to 'the list' (the Altarians are the only ones on it though).
[Message Edited]
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| Egads GROSS is winning! Aggg! I shall double my efforts and give 200%! Is that possible? or should I say 150%? Is that double? Or is 100% all I can give . . . mmmm, now I'm confussed and I think I feel a migrain comming on, mabye even an Anyerism. |
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The Metaverse race is a marathon so don't worry about the small lead GROSS has, Cotal. I'm more concerned with you burning out there. Make sure you pace yourself, take a break once in a while.
| I apologize therefor for my laziness! |
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Absolutely no need for that. Metaverse competition is just one aspect of empiring. I would personally feel that the Fellowship is more about trying to contribute to the game/forum, discussing strategy and indulging in the occassional role-playing/story writing. Competition is for fun and not the key thing here.
| The observations made by others that the scoring system as it stands seeks not to discourage new players (which to its credit it does wonderfully well . . . except for that fellow who got a score of ""9"" . . . hehe) also invites exploitation. |
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Agree that there will never be something near a perfect scoring system. My personal style is to provide some suggestions and opinions but to take whatever system that the developer decides on and play by it. I believe in the argument that if you don't like the system, don't participate in it.
| people say I aslo lack a degree of 'tact' |
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You may be that that but I've never sensed any malice in your words.
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